Clutch question

[Andy_C]

Being new to Morini's just wonder what sort of clutch action I should expect, being a dry clutch.

Mine feels a bit fierce and grabby and very hard to feather.

I know it is a dry clutch and when I took the cover off to take a look, there was evidence of a small amount of oil in the clutch area.

Wondering of perhaps oil has go in there and got onto the plates?

I gather that the oil seal can be replaced by simply removing the clutch - is that right, and could contaminated plates be my problem?

If that is the problem can the plates be cleaned ?

The clutch is adjusted to the book by the way.

[3potjohn]

They can be a bit binary.A few things to look at- it is not uncommon for a slight amount of oil to get past the seals. You may get a quick improvement by squirting brake cleaner into the clutch and watching how much muck comes out.


Otherwise have a look at these on Youtube. Better than the rubbish and appalling scenes on TV

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=yNxVQ4JLm ... Bjb21wdG9u

[Andy_C]

Thanks John - mine is certainly pretty binary.

I'll try the brake cleaner as suggested and keep an eye on the oil situation.

I agree television is pretty rubbish, I only tend to watch a few things on the digital channels such as Sky Arts, and Blaze, but have to admit to watching Coronation Street - there I have said it !!

I also tend to spend a lot of time surfing the web looking for interesting stuff, failing that reading.

[funsize]

Reading, definitely the future. Beats the celebrity & (nowhere near) reality tripe we’re served now. Thank his for my Mk1 kindle

[70sbikes]

Believe it or not, carburetor tune can have a huge impact on clutch action. If both slides are not lifting at the same time, it can induce a fair amount of clutch shudder.

[Andy_C]

Thanks for that re carb tune - will double check the carbs, but that is one of the things I checked just after getting the bike, could have gone out of sync again I guess or may have not done something quite right as I am new to these bikes.

[Andy_C]

Further update, I went for a 20 mile or so ride today on it, and hit some slow moving traffic so plenty of clutch work.

It seems to have improved over how it was at first - much less judder and you can even slip it a little.

Wonder of perhaps the PO had not ridden it much, oh I also checked the carb synch which was OK.

[BumbleBee]

Thanks for that re carb tune - will double check the carbs, but that is one of the things I checked just after getting the bike, could have gone out of sync again I guess or may have not done something quite right as I am new to these bikes.

Also...
Condition of chain, sprockets, cush drive.
And if the engine's response to low throttle settings like we use when pulling away isn't "clean" that can cause issues with not so smooth clutch take-up.

[Andy_C]

Despite the clutch improving it still leaves a lot to be desired, so thought I would take the plates out and take a look.

Normally a simple job - just undo the nuts that tension the springs then pull the springs and plates out.

Well it would be simple, but the nuts look like they are pretty well rusted in place. I have a tool for undoing these nuts that I used to use on Triumphs years ago, but the nuts wont budge, despite the application of WD 40.

Wondering what the best approach is to getting these nuts undone, I do have a very wide impact driver for slotted head screws, thought perhaps I could grind a slot in the end to clear the thread, but concerned that bashing the nuts with an impact driver may not do the clutch basket any good.

At least there is no more signs of oil in the clutch compartment, and I am wondering if perhaps the judder might be caused by rust on the plain plates - dont think it had been used much in recent years before I bought it, the clutch pushrod could probably do with lubricating as well as when you release the clutch lever you can hear a bit of a rubbing noise coming from that area and the lever does not move quite as smoothly as I would like - cable has been lubricated by the way as well as the clutch lever pivot.

Think everything else on the bike is in order, so I just want to get the clutch apart so that I can see how good / bad the plates are, as well as lubricate the pussh rod.

If I end up ruining the nuts then I will be really up the creek, so any help suggestions will be greatly appreciated.

[Steve Brown]

It's not unknown for these nuts to get stuck with rust. Your impact idea may well be worth a go. The studs are threaded into the basket and peened over at the back. So they can be replaced with a bit of work. I'm sure someone here came up with a trick to do this neatly? Something like a small hole saw to cut through the outer edge of the nuts, releasing the springs. Then work on the remains on the bench with a bit more access.
Or just drill through the centre of the stud? All the bits are available new or used so go whichever way you fancy.
No need to over tighten the nuts on replacement and a tiny smear of grease on the thread is ok.
The clutch can be quite nice especially when shimmed correctly but it will always be a little more sudden than most other vehicles, but they will stand a lot of abuse as my trail bikes have proven!

[Tim]

I had this problem and in another post someone suggested freeze and release spray. I tried it as I didn’t want to risk destruction. I was dubious but amazingly it freed all of the clutch nuts. I would recommend giving it a go
https://www.dtc-uk.com/loctite-freeze-r ... ray-400ml/

[norbert]

If you use too much force, the studs will get loose in the basket. I would try first with freezing WD40 and heat. If that doesn´t work you can take off the "collars" of the spring cups with a Dremel. Then you can take out the cups, springs, plates and take off the basket. The old models haver round studs, the "newer" ones have hexagonal studs that you can hold with a wrench while trying to take the nuts off. I did it two times that way with some resisting nuts. It´s much easier and cheaper to find some of this cups (I´ve had plenty of them) than looking for a basket in good condicion.
When you find marks from the steel plates in the slots of the basket you can smooth them down a bit with a file, if they are not too deep. Allways fit the nuts with a bit of copper paste. Then you will have no problems to take them off years later. Just tightem them up without force. Because of the springs and the direction of rotation they won´t get loose

[Andy_C]

As usual many thanks for all the helpful suggestions and advice.

I managed to get the screws undone with no dramas thanks to my home made tool shown at the foot of this posting - a very old cross head screwdriver which I put a slot in and filed down flat. Each screw came undone with a resounding "crack" so think they were probably done up very tight, when I re assemble I shall use a little copper grease and back them off about a quarter turn.

No signs of oil on the plates, no signs of rust either, the plates were in the right order - thinnest one in first, the dished plain steel between the last to friction plates with the dish pointing outwards.

Hardly any wear in the basket or hub but quite a lot of old dust which I cleaned out with some brake and clutch cleaner.

I checked the steel plates for flatness on a piece of plate glass that I have, one of the steels is not quite flat and it is also looks like it has got pretty hot at sometime, so I think it worth replacing it - just need to find someplace I can buy a single steel as the rest are nice and flat, and the frictions are in tolerance.

Only thing I cant do is adjust the clutch arm to the 15mm position away from the case, if I do that the cable inner is too long, so I wonder if I should get a new cable - perhaps it has stretched, or does the clutch arm position not have much effect on the clutch action?

The tool:

[3potjohn]

One steel should be convex slightly and I think a bit thinner.
I have found one can adjust the lever so it is not quite touching the case then see what the cable is like. Too much adjustment the other way and the arm may contact the chain. The dimple on the arm which bears on the pushrod is usually worn a bit. It is possible to refurb that with weld, though I have no experience of this.
My friend has similar stuck clutch nuts. After a bit of a try we got all but one undone.

[Andy_C]

John - it is one of the friction plates that is slightly thiner and is the one that goes into the basket first (so I have read), again, so I have read, the convex one goes between the last pair of friction plates - happy to stand corrected on any of this.

Sounds like I can leave the clutch arm as is as the clutch disengages OK and it does not contact the case.

Just need to find a replacement plain plate to replace the one that is not flat - and I dont mean the convex one.