Project Kanguro Supermoto!

Camel, Sahara, Kanguro, Coguaro

Project Kanguro Supermoto!

Postby robinh44 » 17 Jul 2006 10:18

Hi,

Just thought I would post a picture of my project progress so far. This is the chassis mockup using the Kanguro frame with the forks of a Husqvarna SM610, front wheel from a Suzuki Bandit 1200, the rear end including wheel is from a Suzuki SV650. Aiming to complete rear end suspension and wheel alignment by August.

Regards

Robin

Image[/img][/url]
1984 Kanguro X1 home built special.
'Using yesterday's technology to create tomorrow's problem's today'
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Postby richmaz » 21 Jul 2006 21:48

Thanx for the pic, Robin. Continue with the updates please - I'm sure other Kanguro owners (liked me) will be watching with interest! Are you looking to keep the original tank / side panels etc or just the Morini frame and engine?
Richard M
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Postby robinh44 » 22 Jul 2006 09:12

Richard

Firstly thanks for your response. Regarding the tank and side panels, I am planning to replace the tank with a Honda FT500 one as I want to create a combination look of Supermoto and flat tracker. Also as a personal preference I am fitting a single seat unit from a BMW R850R. So depending on how the tank/seat combo look and fit I will probably end up making some side panels from stainless or aluminium sheet. Current problems are connecting the swinging arm to the frame and suspension, once rolling chassis complete then project to pickup pace. Need to get ready for next years track day!! watch this space.

Regards

Robin
1984 Kanguro X1 home built special.
'Using yesterday's technology to create tomorrow's problem's today'
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Postby huub » 24 Jul 2006 15:52

Nice project!
you beat me to it, i was also considering building a SM morini.

you might find the wheelbase a bit long using this swing arm.
the wheel size is going to slow the steering down considerably, so you dont really need a long wheelbase.

when building my guzzi supermoto i had to shorten the swing arm to get anywhere near a normal wheel base.

Image

keep us informed , i am very curious about the end result

cheers,
Hubert
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Postby robinh44 » 24 Jul 2006 20:58

Hubert

Thanks for the reply, you have beaten me to my next project if and when I complete this one. I was tentatively wondering what a V65 Lario would be like in supermoto trim. Regarding the wheelbase, I measured the additional length which was about 20-30mm longer. I am planning to see how far I can jack the back up to steepen the steering angle and quicken the steering. I am considering welding additional lugs to the top shock absorber mount to allow different rear end heights, also I could drop the yokes slightly. I am Impressed with your guzzi, are they standard guzzi wheels?, with a 16" front I would have thought the front would steer quicker?. Next update will be end of next week when I should complete the swinging arm fitment.

Regards

Robin
1984 Kanguro X1 home built special.
'Using yesterday's technology to create tomorrow's problem's today'
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Postby huub » 25 Jul 2006 11:18

I ended up with a 151 mm wheelbase on the guzzi,( the same as the KTM supermoto )
but the KTM has a slight power advantage.......
i have a lario engine waiting for the guzzi, so we seem to be affected with the same illness.

the wheels on the pics are modified fzr 600, with a 4.5x18 rear, and a 3x17 front.
i also have a 17 inch rear, but the gearing with the 17 inch is just too short, and changing the gearing on a guzzi is a pain.

handling with the supermoto wheels is surprisingly stable, mostly because of the huge rear tire.
i tried the guzzi once with the stock rear end, and the supermoto front.
that was scary, a uncontrollable violent speed wobble at anything over 50 mph.

i dont think you can drop the swing arm very much without the chain hitting the swing arm.
best check that before adding the lugs

cheers,
Hubert
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Postby robinh44 » 25 Jul 2006 14:15

Hubert

I will check the wheelbase next week and advise the range based on the chain/swing arm position and seat height. Current issue is the Suzuki SV650 aluminium swinging arm i am using. Because the Morini chain drive is on the opposite side I have had to turn the swinging arm over. Now I have to reposition the suspension linkage mount on the swinging arm. After much thought I am going to use so 0.4 ton lifting eye bolts I have spotted, and refabricate a mount on the underside using the original needle roller bearing. I was contemplating aluminium welding but after some early attempts with my mig outfit, I have decided to stick to mig mild/stainless steel welding which will be fine for the frame and exhausts. The wheels on mine are 17" with Metzelers MEZ4 120/60 front and 160/60 rear, which as you say should give stable handling. By the way how did you mod the Yamaha wheel to run on the guzzi shaft drive?, also where are you based just in case I need to check your guzzi out for my next project.

Regards

Robin
1984 Kanguro X1 home built special.
'Using yesterday's technology to create tomorrow's problem's today'
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Postby Sander » 25 Jul 2006 17:25

I ended up with a 151 mm wheelbase on the guzzi,


You must have very small wheels to use such a short wheelbase :lol:
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Postby huub » 26 Jul 2006 09:54

Robin,

i have the same problem welding alu,
that is how i ended up with a stainless swing arm in the guzzi.
the yamaha wheel needed the hub narrowed at the cush drive side, and a adapter for the cush drive.
but the swing arm was the real headache, the original swing arm is too narrow to fit modern tires.

you could try to find a PDS shock from a modern KTM,
at least it would save you from adding a linkage to the shock.
they might be a bit long for a morini (41 cm?)

cheers,
Hubert

PS i am based in the netherlands, not exactly around the corner....
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Postby richmaz » 31 Jul 2006 16:56

V interesting posts, guys! Just goes to show that to convert your bike to a supermoto doesn't necessarily just mean smaller wheels and tyres! Plenty of challenges ahead no doubt, but several already overcome - your approach to the projects seems to suggest that you're both from an engineering background?

FT500 tank, Robin - good choice and I hope it visually comes together well with the BM seat. Brought a smile to my face as I had an FT in the early '80's and thought is was a cracking looking bike.
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Postby robinh44 » 31 Jul 2006 17:21

Rich

My engineering background consists of a mispent youth (pushbikes & mopeds) & a 4 year engineering apprenticeship in the early 80's, but I then was lured by computers. Now realising the folly of my youth I 'fettle' as a hobby to keep my sanity, particularly as I am now working more & more with software argh!.
Back to the point, yes the FT500 tank came as an inspiration while mulling over supermoto and flat tracker design. How I am going to blend the FT500 tank to the BMW R850 seat I am not sure, but that is the challenge. To help the blending process I am planning to make a tail piece similar to the Storz units that have a similar profile to the FT500 tank and will set off the Ducati 996 Termigoni silencers I am fitting.
I have taken this week off just to 'fettle'. Good progress today, wheel alignment sorted, swinging arm frame mounts ready for me to weld tommorrow after a full day of fabricating with the hacksaw and grinder. I will post some pics at the end of the week showing hopefully some progress.

Regards

Robin
1984 Kanguro X1 home built special.
'Using yesterday's technology to create tomorrow's problem's today'
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Postby richmaz » 31 Jul 2006 20:40

Robin

FT tank and R850 seat - hopefully it'll look okay :!: Perhaps a typical thin 'plank' seat and tail unit would look better (not sure what from, but all I can think of is the Harley XR750, I think!). But the BM seat would be soooooo confortable :lol:
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Postby robinh44 » 31 Jul 2006 21:44

Richard

Yes the comfort part is the primary goal, looks are secondary. I have a thin plank seat on my Yamaha XT225 Serow, 30 mins ride time and numb behind!. I will be reshaping the front of the seat, but it should look similar in proportions to the XR750 style seat, just a bit wider at the rear. I have some leather to cover it, and have enlisted the local shoe repair shop to do the stitching.

Regards

Robin
1984 Kanguro X1 home built special.
'Using yesterday's technology to create tomorrow's problem's today'
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Postby robinh44 » 02 Aug 2006 22:05

Hi,

Well halfway through my week off, 3 solid days of building. Firstly a picture of my state of the art facilities, my garage:-

Image

My modified swinging arm mounts points, ground most of the old ones out and made new ones from 3mm steel plate. It may not be pretty but they won't fall off..... I hope:-

Image

Finally the poor old Suzuki swinging arm now missing its suspension linkage mount, I need it on the other side!:-

Image

More on Friday.

Regards

Robin[/img]
1984 Kanguro X1 home built special.
'Using yesterday's technology to create tomorrow's problem's today'
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Postby robinh44 » 04 Aug 2006 21:08

Hi,

Final update for a while, success on phase 1 the rolling chassis build. It has taken me 5 full days of design, fabrication and sometimes re-design and re-fabrication to integrate the Suzuki SV650 rear swinging arm/suspension . Just some welding to finish off tommorrow. For the benefit of Hubert and the wheelbase discussion, mine is currently 1530mm but there is room to move the rear wheel forwards by 30mm if I need to. I will wait and see how it goes first.

Rear view of swingarm and rear shock:-
Image
Front view of swingarm and rear shock:-
Image
Side view of swingarm and rear shock:-
Image
The current state of project, rolling chassis ready:-
Image

Next step is to refit engine and check and correct chain alignment, then next big phase is to plumb in the Ducati 996 termigoni silencers!!, I will post in separate post.

Regards

Robin
1984 Kanguro X1 home built special.
'Using yesterday's technology to create tomorrow's problem's today'
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